Blog - Page 8 of 9 - Fiddler Dan Violins & Workshop, Brisbane

Buying a violin on facebook or gumtree? Some tips…

Chances are if you’re reading this then you are in the market for a secondhand violin maybe on facebook or gumtree and why not a secondhand violin can be better than new . While I hope you’ll come and checkout what I have on offer ( and why you might buy a preloved violin from me), here is a dozen or so tips if your going to get one yourself on gumtree or facebook!

Chances are you’ll do OK, most people are pretty straight-up and honest about what they have, but they don’t actually know themselves and there is the odd bit of firewood out there masquerading as a violin. So here is my dozen or so tips on what to look out for

1. Bow – does it have more hair than me – these guys wear out. does it have the reverse curve

2. Case – scruffy is OK, structurally unsound..not Ok.

3. Open seams – fixable..but probably not by you

4. Body cracks – likely needs opening up…an expensive fix and probably not worth it

5. Endpin cracks – might be superficial…might not

6. peg action and cracks – sticky or sloppy pegs, eliptical pegs, cracks in the peg box

7. Bridge – bent? at the wrong height, badly fitted

8. Action – strings low enough to be easy to play – but not buzzing

9. Chips – cosmetic usually – but can lead to splitting down the track…get them seen too!

10. Strings – only last a year, still work after than but might be fuzzy, nt hold a note and sound not very good

11. Brand – google the brand (inside the f hole) give you an idea of if its reputable

12. Price when new. How much do you need to spend well google it. I recon about $300 + $100 per year of playing I recon is about right.

If you can have play it, and bring along another similar violin for comparison of sound (acoustics can change the sound dramatically) that will help too.

Finally don’t be afraid to ask the seller about the provenance, that is where they got it and how long they have had it . They might be embarrassed to say its third hand (but shouldn’t be), if it hasn’t seen the inside of a violin shop in a while though make sure to give it some love.

Here’s a one take video version of the above, if you have 5min or so of your life to lose. Its not fancey but you might find it helpful.

Vale Music Express

I can’t believe it, one day I was dropping into to MusicExpress near garden City and the doors were shut…forever. This music store has literally been a music store institution on Brisbane’s Southside. If you needed a music book, strings, guitar headstock in a hurry… or even an instrument this was the go to local store. Good selection, reasonable pricing and expert advice from actual musos!

I have been going there ever since my school days (yes I’m a local from Upper Mount Gravatt Primary and Mt. Gravatt High School). Amazingly some of the staff there I can remember from my school days, one of them I even went to school with.

Music Express was the successor to Go Music way back when, with a store opposite Garden City (did you know it was once the local Bank of New South Wales…err Westpac branch) and a music store branch in Garden City as well, this is the corner I sold newspapers on to buy a new violin too (but that is a long story for another time).

A memorable recent experience of Music Express was dropping in to buy a harmonica for my son for a present. I wanted a C harp, but they were all sold out, I asked if they had any in A minor instead (Warning Dad joke musician humour) . The look I got was priceless 😉

It leaves the Brisbane southside a bit thing on the ground for music shops and Violin shops, with Massons closing a few years back. There is a piano shop in Sunnybank that sells a few, other wise you can head to Olaf the violin maker for top shelf instruments or cross the river to Animato and Simply for Strings. Music expressts brought a few more people my way looking for violins..sorry to all the clarinet players out there though…I don’t stock reeds

Inside a $400 student violin

There are some really nice violins around for around $400. They look great and sound great…for the money…so how do they do it? For a start its made in China (the cost of labour is low) and the quality of workman ship can be really good as well (your iPhone is made there after all)

While the attention to the finish on the outside is good, the bits you can’t see are where acceptable shortcuts can be taken. Here is the inside of a popular $400 violin you can buy in Brisbane at a specialist strings shop. You are looking on the right at the neck block. It fits , mostly, and the linings are mostly attached. Could probably be refined..sure, but that takes time and that means more money on the price for something you can’t see.

You can also see a cleat helping hold the 2 piece back together – usually seen on a repair , not a new instrument. Also usually the cleat needs to be across the 2 pieces its joining..this isn’t the case lower down (I fixed it before thinking to take a photo though)

The bass bar on this instrument is also part of the body (a relief left after carving out the top) rather than a fitted separate piece . This again saves more time (fitting of a bass bar), though a fitted bass bar usually improves the sound, as you can tune the top first, then fit the piece.

Anyways if you are waiting for the hard sell…there isn’t any…you get what you pay simple as that. I see this instrument brand I see a lot and it does OK sound wise.

Fiddler Dan’s Boy Band

I’m in a boy band, thats what my mum recons, of course she’s in her seventies and that makes me…ummm yeah well never mind.

I’m the youngest member in my boy band, they all play songs I’ve never heard of …well mostly….. there is Roger Whitaker, Linda Ronstat and some of that modern stuff like Neil Diamond. I joined my boy band a few years back, to diversify my musical experience , I wanted to get away from notes and start feeling the music and improvising more.

My boy band is down at the Mt. Gravatt Mens Shed its a jam group of professional, semi professional and hacks alike (I won’t tell you which category I fall into …it wouldn’t be good for my reputation). Basil keeps us honest leading us from the keyboards.

It grew out of their long running beginner guitar lessons and features guitars, uke, harmonicas, bass, keyboards and a drummer or two (they keep each other in time). On my first visit they tried to get me to learn guitar…I told them old timers I was too old to learn something new 😉

It mostly just jammin’ but we have a few gigs here and there to help with focus. My only worry is gigging at senior citizens association, I’m a bit worried they might throw their underwear at us 😉

(image credit Mt. Gravatt Mens shed newsletter)

Brisbane Cheap Violins

Maybe you saw the google ad for Brisbane Cheap Violins and thought hey they look good and only $44.99

They certainly look the part and much cheaper that the $300-500 a music store might offer, so whats the catch? These are often referred to as VSO’s Violin Shaped Objects in the trade, because all appearances seem OK, but the proof is in the pudding, is it playable, does it sound ok when played? and will it go the distance?. If you not a player you may think if it looks ok, it must be OK!, If your child (or yourself) has just started learning you may think well they are not going to know the different anyway about the sound…and will it go the distance that something I can answer, having seen a few in my time come across my workbench, but more on that in a minute.

Loving the sound

It takes probably around 3 years to get over that enough of a hump in learning to start to sound good and enjoy playing the violin. Prior to this its hard yards, and if you have a violin that is hard to play…and even if played well won’t sound all that good. It’s off putting and if you add up the hours you are going to spend encouraging someone to practice, taking them to lessons and rehearsals and paying for lessons if they are private students. Put a dollar value on your time and your childs time, say $5 per hour, you are up to thopusands of dollars of your time you are going to invest…. so make sure to get a good violin that can support this, right from the get go!

What right… and what’s not

Cheap violins that have come across my bench, generally they are structurally Ok. Ok the timbers are not the best and might not be all that resonant. Often though the toughest part is the strings sit too high for fingers to push them down , the pegs don’t turn smoothl. The pegs, fingerboard and bridge will need some attention to rectify this . The running gear , the strings are usually straight steel and give that characteristic tinny sound. The bow will often be too soft (like a rubber chicken), playable sure, but to get any projection or tonal nuance out of them is going to be tricky. All of this is fixable , but if you put that into a better instrument to start with you’ll be much better off

Its really a false economy to get yourself a VSO cheap violin…steer clear if you don’t know what you are looking for. Have a look at my preloved instruments, you much find something you like and for not a lot more money. Secondhand is not second best when it comes to violins

So the next time you are browsing ebay or googling ‘brisbane cheap violins’ or at a discount supermarket starting with ‘A’ picking up some groceries, a fire hose, 2 car jacks and a trombone…maybe pass on the blue violin thats on special 😉

European sounding Violin, but without the price

Here are 3 sound files 2 from violins I sell for around $500 and another from a well known European student brand (Gliga II) which retails for around $900. Which is which?…you be the judge. If you like the sound of my violins, or can’t tell them apart checkout my new instruments

To be fair violins are not just about the sound. There is a sense of history with the European violins, they use European timber, the price of labour is higher there and the traditional finish is lovely though quite labour intensive to produce.

Why buy a secondhand violin

New violins can be expensive, and for the most part they don’t wear out and represent a sound investment, so why buy a second hand violin aka a preloved instrument

Firstly its easier on the pocket, as soon as something walk out the door of a shop its already dropped in value. So if you can pick on up in great condition you are getting the same thing, but for less money

Secondly Violins can age really well, the timbers in them continue to season over the years and so an aged instrument will likely sound better. It sounds better because the moisture comes out of the tonewood gradually and allows more favourable resonance. For new student violins, the timbers haven’t been aged all that long , just a few years, where as the more expensive instruments have been aged 10, 20 or even 30 years. A secondhand instruments timbers are aging and so improving all the time

Thirdly its not bad for the environment, especially as your child is growing there is no need to have a cupboard of violins of sizes that no longer fit. If you use a preloved instrument, your saving another tree from being chopped down

Forthly, violins are all about history, and while your secondhand instrument is unlikely to be a Strad, Amarti or Guarneri in quality or age you might wonder to yourself how many concerts has your violin played in?

Check out my preloved violins…you might find something you like.

Having said that there is nothing quite like a new violin under the XMAS tree or when a student moves up a size as something really special. Check out my new violins, I have chosen these for sound (though they look great), but without the brand so the prices are quite reasonable.

Perfection…isn’t about being perfect

One of the challenges of the classical music traditions is that whilst we strive for perfection, sometimes that can get in the way of enjoyment. You don’t have to be the best, strive for it sure…but make sure you are enjoying it along the way.

My Mando taught me this, just this last weekend. An idealic setting, relaxing and enjoying playing some music with family….even if i did forget my pick!

Beyond Classical Violin

Anyone thats learnt violin that is any good has likely started in the classical tradition. The violin is such a technical instrument that the disciple of classical training really is a must to get the left hand, right hand and expression really happening. If you learn privately or through a school its classical or classical based pedagogy. It leaves you well equipped technically, able to play the standard pieces and read almost any music on sight and play it. (Image: Mark Woods a Juilliard school classically trained violinist who switched to rock)

The challenge is then where to from here, the opportunities apart from those that really excel are there is a few professional orchestras, unlike European where every town/village has at least a sprinkling or orchestras. If you lucky there are a few community orchestras where you can play as well as hymmns on a Sunday (if a church environment works for you) . And so sadly by the time you finish school the violin might go up on the shelf and never come down again.

The great news is that today there is a lot more music than classical music in our culture and with a little work then is some fantastic playing opportunities. By work I mean becoming more musically educationed. We are great copiers of written music, but to embrace other genres we need to understand a bit about how its put together, feel it and express it. This might mean learning a little more music theory, to get a way from melody (thats the domain of vocalists) to harmony, counterpoint and even rhythm as a backing instrument, that does fills, rifts and the occassional solo. Then find a genre that you like to listen too like folk, jazz, blues, rock, country, worship or somewhere in between. Then start hunting for playing opportunities, it might be a sit down with a pal that plays guitar or keyboard and see where it takes you, there are lots of bands and music groups out in the community when you are ready . You’ll have to embrace the terror that is jammin’, iterate towards what works if you don’t find it straight away. Finally be warned you will suck….but over time you will suck less.

See my links page for some resources listening, educational and playing resources to get you going.

Stentor Violin Review

I see the Stentor violins coming through reasonably often, they are defiantly a budget line instrument and can be had for as low as $200 new, depending on the model. You get what you pay for with violins so you shouldn’t expect the sound to be wonderful… but its a solid reliable performer. Usually the fingerboard isn’t ebony which doesn’t really matter so much if its your first instrument, you not sliding around in the positions just yet anyway. If the violin is coming to you third hand it might matter as it will likely have some grooves from the strings they need planing out. Probably the greatest issue with them is being a cheaper instrument they are less likely to be carried by a specialist string store initially and so might not have been setup all that well, making it harder to play with the strings too high at the bridge or nut.

So all up an OK choice for your very first instrument as a 1/2 size but for a larger instrument or one you will have for longer you might consider spending a bit more.

Consider choosing a secondhand violin from me if your budget is tight or spend just a bit more on something like my Neo violins