At some stage in a violinists journey there is the thought of going electric, wether it is the dream of being the next Jimi Hendrix on violin, or wanting to be able to practice quietly, or something in between like Lindsay Sterling (my sons favourite violinist). There are plenty available to buy from the really cheap to the really expensive. I’ve certainly had a dabble with them over the years (see my violins) where mostly its been a suck it and see approach. In the early years I’ve been disappointed by pickups (until I learnt about impedance matching and preamps much later that is).
These days I prefer a mic attached to my violin and a multi effects pedal for most things. Of course thats not always a good fit, if you diving into the more enthusiastic genres where it gets loud, the wonderful resonant cavity that is a violin is a breeding ground for un controllable feedback. in such a case a solid body electric is the way to go.
I thought about making a video about it all, and then discovered Karin from just down the road (well the Gold Coast isn’t all that far from Brisbane) has been there and done that. As a gigging musician diving into several genres through Casablanca Sounds she has an acoustic, semi acoustic and electric ready to select for any occasion. She recorded this video which talks us through them all…enjoy…and thanks for sharing Karin 🙂
This is her in action recently too…music not gymnastics…love it!
Chances are if you’re reading this then you are in the market for a secondhand violin maybe on facebook or gumtree and why not a secondhand violin can be better than new . While I hope you’ll come and checkout what I have on offer ( and why you might buy a preloved violin from me), here is a dozen or so tips if your going to get one yourself on gumtree or facebook!
Chances are you’ll do OK, most people are pretty straight-up and honest about what they have, but they don’t actually know themselves and there is the odd bit of firewood out there masquerading as a violin. So here is my dozen or so tips on what to look out for
1. Bow – does it have more hair than me – these guys wear out. does it have the reverse curve
2. Case – scruffy is OK, structurally unsound..not Ok.
3. Open seams – fixable..but probably not by you
4. Body cracks – likely needs opening up…an expensive fix and probably not worth it
5. Endpin cracks – might be superficial…might not
6. peg action and cracks – sticky or sloppy pegs, eliptical pegs, cracks in the peg box
7. Bridge – bent? at the wrong height, badly fitted
8. Action – strings low enough to be easy to play – but not buzzing
9. Chips – cosmetic usually – but can lead to splitting down the track…get them seen too!
10. Strings – only last a year, still work after than but might be fuzzy, nt hold a note and sound not very good
11. Brand – google the brand (inside the f hole) give you an idea of if its reputable
12. Price when new. How much do you need to spend well google it. I recon about $300 + $100 per year of playing I recon is about right.
If you can have play it, and bring along another similar violin for comparison of sound (acoustics can change the sound dramatically) that will help too.
Finally don’t be afraid to ask the seller about the provenance, that is where they got it and how long they have had it . They might be embarrassed to say its third hand (but shouldn’t be), if it hasn’t seen the inside of a violin shop in a while though make sure to give it some love.
Here’s a one take video version of the above, if you have 5min or so of your life to lose. Its not fancey but you might find it helpful.
I can’t believe it, one day I was dropping into to MusicExpress near garden City and the doors were shut…forever. This music store has literally been a music store institution on Brisbane’s Southside. If you needed a music book, strings, guitar headstock in a hurry… or even an instrument this was the go to local store. Good selection, reasonable pricing and expert advice from actual musos!
I have been going there ever since my school days (yes I’m a local from Upper Mount Gravatt Primary and Mt. Gravatt High School). Amazingly some of the staff there I can remember from my school days, one of them I even went to school with.
Music Express was the successor to Go Music way back when, with a store opposite Garden City (did you know it was once the local Bank of New South Wales…err Westpac branch) and a music store branch in Garden City as well, this is the corner I sold newspapers on to buy a new violin too (but that is a long story for another time).
A memorable recent experience of Music Express was dropping in to buy a harmonica for my son for a present. I wanted a C harp, but they were all sold out, I asked if they had any in A minor instead (Warning Dad joke musician humour) . The look I got was priceless 😉
It leaves the Brisbane southside a bit thing on the ground for music shops and Violin shops, with Massons closing a few years back. There is a piano shop in Sunnybank that sells a few, other wise you can head to Olaf the violin maker for top shelf instruments or cross the river to Animato and Simply for Strings. Music expressts brought a few more people my way looking for violins..sorry to all the clarinet players out there though…I don’t stock reeds
There are some really nice violins around for around $400. They look great and sound great…for the money…so how do they do it? For a start its made in China (the cost of labour is low) and the quality of workman ship can be really good as well (your iPhone is made there after all)
While the attention to the finish on the outside is good, the bits you can’t see are where acceptable shortcuts can be taken. Here is the inside of a popular $400 violin you can buy in Brisbane at a specialist strings shop. You are looking on the right at the neck block. It fits , mostly, and the linings are mostly attached. Could probably be refined..sure, but that takes time and that means more money on the price for something you can’t see.
You can also see a cleat helping hold the 2 piece back together – usually seen on a repair , not a new instrument. Also usually the cleat needs to be across the 2 pieces its joining..this isn’t the case lower down (I fixed it before thinking to take a photo though)
The bass bar on this instrument is also part of the body (a relief left after carving out the top) rather than a fitted separate piece . This again saves more time (fitting of a bass bar), though a fitted bass bar usually improves the sound, as you can tune the top first, then fit the piece.
Anyways if you are waiting for the hard sell…there isn’t any…you get what you pay simple as that. I see this instrument brand I see a lot and it does OK sound wise.
Maybe you saw the google ad for Brisbane Cheap Violins and thought hey they look good and only $44.99
They certainly look the part and much cheaper that the $300-500 a music store might offer, so whats the catch? These are often referred to as VSO’s Violin Shaped Objects in the trade, because all appearances seem OK, but the proof is in the pudding, is it playable, does it sound ok when played? and will it go the distance?. If you not a player you may think if it looks ok, it must be OK!, If your child (or yourself) has just started learning you may think well they are not going to know the different anyway about the sound…and will it go the distance that something I can answer, having seen a few in my time come across my workbench, but more on that in a minute.
Loving the sound
It takes probably around 3 years to get over that enough of a hump in learning to start to sound good and enjoy playing the violin. Prior to this its hard yards, and if you have a violin that is hard to play…and even if played well won’t sound all that good. It’s off putting and if you add up the hours you are going to spend encouraging someone to practice, taking them to lessons and rehearsals and paying for lessons if they are private students. Put a dollar value on your time and your childs time, say $5 per hour, you are up to thopusands of dollars of your time you are going to invest…. so make sure to get a good violin that can support this, right from the get go!
What right… and what’s not
Cheap violins that have come across my bench, generally they are structurally Ok. Ok the timbers are not the best and might not be all that resonant. Often though the toughest part is the strings sit too high for fingers to push them down , the pegs don’t turn smoothl. The pegs, fingerboard and bridge will need some attention to rectify this . The running gear , the strings are usually straight steel and give that characteristic tinny sound. The bow will often be too soft (like a rubber chicken), playable sure, but to get any projection or tonal nuance out of them is going to be tricky. All of this is fixable , but if you put that into a better instrument to start with you’ll be much better off
Its really a false economy to get yourself a VSO cheap violin…steer clear if you don’t know what you are looking for. Have a look at my preloved instruments, you much find something you like and for not a lot more money. Secondhand is not second best when it comes to violins
So the next time you are browsing ebay or googling ‘brisbane cheap violins’ or at a discount supermarket starting with ‘A’ picking up some groceries, a fire hose, 2 car jacks and a trombone…maybe pass on the blue violin thats on special 😉
Here are 3 sound files 2 from violins I sell for around $500 and another from a well known European student brand (Gliga II) which retails for around $900. Which is which?…you be the judge. If you like the sound of my violins, or can’t tell them apart checkout my new instruments
To be fair violins are not just about the sound. There is a sense of history with the European violins, they use European timber, the price of labour is higher there and the traditional finish is lovely though quite labour intensive to produce.
New violins can be expensive, and for the most part they don’t wear out and represent a sound investment, so why buy a second hand violin aka a preloved instrument
Firstly its easier on the pocket, as soon as something walk out the door of a shop its already dropped in value. So if you can pick on up in great condition you are getting the same thing, but for less money
Secondly Violins can age really well, the timbers in them continue to season over the years and so an aged instrument will likely sound better. It sounds better because the moisture comes out of the tonewood gradually and allows more favourable resonance. For new student violins, the timbers haven’t been aged all that long , just a few years, where as the more expensive instruments have been aged 10, 20 or even 30 years. A secondhand instruments timbers are aging and so improving all the time
Thirdly its not bad for the environment, especially as your child is growing there is no need to have a cupboard of violins of sizes that no longer fit. If you use a preloved instrument, your saving another tree from being chopped down
Forthly, violins are all about history, and while your secondhand instrument is unlikely to be a Strad, Amarti or Guarneri in quality or age you might wonder to yourself how many concerts has your violin played in?
Check out my preloved violins…you might find something you like.
Having said that there is nothing quite like a new violin under the XMAS tree or when a student moves up a size as something really special. Check out my new violins, I have chosen these for sound (though they look great), but without the brand so the prices are quite reasonable.
One of the challenges of the classical music traditions is that whilst we strive for perfection, sometimes that can get in the way of enjoyment. You don’t have to be the best, strive for it sure…but make sure you are enjoying it along the way.
My Mando taught me this, just this last weekend. An idealic setting, relaxing and enjoying playing some music with family….even if i did forget my pick!
Anyone thats learnt violin that is any good has likely started in the classical tradition. The violin is such a technical instrument that the disciple of classical training really is a must to get the left hand, right hand and expression really happening. If you learn privately or through a school its classical or classical based pedagogy. It leaves you well equipped technically, able to play the standard pieces and read almost any music on sight and play it. (Image: Mark Woods a Juilliard school classically trained violinist who switched to rock)
The challenge is then where to from here, the opportunities apart from those that really excel are there is a few professional orchestras, unlike European where every town/village has at least a sprinkling or orchestras. If you lucky there are a few community orchestras where you can play as well as hymmns on a Sunday (if a church environment works for you) . And so sadly by the time you finish school the violin might go up on the shelf and never come down again.
The great news is that today there is a lot more music than classical music in our culture and with a little work then is some fantastic playing opportunities. By work I mean becoming more musically educationed. We are great copiers of written music, but to embrace other genres we need to understand a bit about how its put together, feel it and express it. This might mean learning a little more music theory, to get a way from melody (thats the domain of vocalists) to harmony, counterpoint and even rhythm as a backing instrument, that does fills, rifts and the occassional solo. Then find a genre that you like to listen too like folk, jazz, blues, rock, country, worship or somewhere in between. Then start hunting for playing opportunities, it might be a sit down with a pal that plays guitar or keyboard and see where it takes you, there are lots of bands and music groups out in the community when you are ready . You’ll have to embrace the terror that is jammin’, iterate towards what works if you don’t find it straight away. Finally be warned you will suck….but over time you will suck less.
See my links page for some resources listening, educational and playing resources to get you going.
Getting better at the violin is a lot like sport (something Australia does very well). It takes dedication, practice and the right input at the right time. This is where an experienced violin teacher comes in, but it also about creating the right environment or ecosystem to learn in.
Professionally I worked with Australias elite sports organisations for many years developing tools for improving co-ordination and skills at the highest levels, returbning to violin as an adult I have really enjoyed seing the pedagogy of violin playing again. One of my favourite authors is Simon Fischer who has a fabulous book series on the pegadodgies of the violin. See Links for more
Traditional practice is chunks of 30min to 1 hr in time, but there are other ways to get there – especially with children. Firstly barriers to pracvtice need to be removed, often its as simple as making sure that it is easy and convenient. An open violin case in a special nook in the house makes it easy to pickup the violin and go. A quick set of scales before hoping in the car to school, play your favourite piece before dinner, or between dinner and dessert (a nice micro reward) can help build up time spent ‘on violin’ and establishing habits.
Learning the skills
Skill acquisition, that is the learning of skills takes time, many talk about the 10,000 hours to expertise, and while that is a gross simplification, time on the violin is essential to making progress. Of course it needs to be good time with attention to detail – thats the role of a teacher. learning consists of multiple methodolof=gies and a mix is required for success and the mix is individual.
Fine motor skills take time to develop drills (like scales) are essential for building the vocabulry, playing for enjoyment and without self critique is important, in sport they call this error free learning.
The learnignof technical skills is many fold, left hand, right hand, bow preassure, bow point, reading music all need to develop togeteher to make a decent sound. i suspect this is why many students never get over the hump to sounding good just when they are breaking through
Enjoyment, it takes a while to get here…so don’t give up. Finding music that you like and music that you can play is essential, as to an outlet for playing .
Performance matters
The opportunities for violinists to regularly perform are somewhat limited for the classical purist. Unlike your average town in Europe with a plethora of orchestras, there are often just a few on the surface and many of them require a high skill lvel (like the QYO). Regular opporunity to play with other and especially to perform adds an opportunity for feedback and feelings of accomplishment. So whats budding violinist to do. If you are ;lickiy enouygh to be learning at school then you might have an orchestra you can play in, with at least a couple of performance opportunitiesa year. So how to get more, you can look to community orchestras, if you learning privately you teacher might have an ensemble. If your not averse to church type environments (across many faiths)), many churchs have bands playing traditional hymns through to contemporary music (if you are happy to strech yourself). At its simplist violin and piano playing hymns go very well togeteher. Hiding in the piano part are often harmonies (especially if you learn to read the bass clef). Delvuig into the work of chords can have you harmonising and improvising as well 9its challenging but you can do it)
